Two friends of mine got into a highly explosive argument over this post and are currently not speaking. I thought the subject of their discussion was worth opening up to all of you.
Last week we all discussed "Tebowing" and our feelings about it (btw, thank you for keeping the conversation productive and interesting. I learned a lot and loved following the debate!). My friends branched off into a similar discussion, off the blog, about American tolerance of Christian public displays of faith vs. public displays of other faiths.
One friend wondered if we would be accepting of a non-Christian form of "Tebowing"? It's Feedback Friday...Here was the basis of their debate and eventual argument:
Would you feel comfortable with a player on the football field in a Muslim/Jewish/Buddhist etc... posture of prayer?
Would you feel comfortable with a player on the football field with quotes from the Koran on his eye black?
Would you feel comfortable with a player on the football field with quotes from the Koran on his eye black?
i don't see the problem i'm not religieus, i don't pray at all. But i do have al lot of muslims around me and if they pray ( what they mostly do in private by the way ;) ) of express their religion in any other way, i don't care. A,nd they don't have a problem with me not praying....
ReplyDeleteI have recently realized that I am probably more religious than average. Actually, my blog helped me realize this during Christmas time. I am a Catechist (I've taught Sunday School for the last 12 years) and I've almost always gone to Catholic or Christian schools so I have been raised around a lot of people in religious life (nuns, priests, brothers, missionaries). To me talking about your faith is the norm.
ReplyDeleteI thought Tebow was nice because I always like to see someone who is proud of their faith. I think it shows good character that a person is not afraid to show they believe in good values. Sometimes people associate having good values with being boring, unfun and uncool and I think that is lousy. I was happy to see someone helping young people feel that their values are important even if other people don't think they are cool. And I wouldn't feel any differently if the person displayed their non-Christian faith.
As I said last week, as a strong Christian woman I think it's wonderful that Tebow uses his fame to promote Jesus. It's not the message, but the delivery. The only part that makes me feel uncomfortable is that I feel that sometimes the reverence due the Savior of the World is lacking. Having no deep feelings about Muhammad or Buddha, I wouldn't feel at all uncomfortable.
ReplyDeleteMy problem with him is less that he displays his Xian faith and more that people/he believe he wins games because god deems it so. And the BLATANT idol worship of him. It's disgusting. I feel like it sums up America's twisted belief in prosperity gospel and how poor is bad and rich is good.
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely! It is a free country so everyone can worship anyway they like as long as it isn't physically hurting someone else.
ReplyDeleteGo for it - any act of faith - who is it hurting? And if kids are going around "Tebowing" in a disrespectful manner (something we discuss at my house), AT LEAST they are seeing an example of someone who lives his faith and praises God, vs. some other examples in their lives.....like popular music that is so foul and disrespectful to women (for example "if she ever tries to leave again I'm gonna tie her to the bed and set this house on fire").
ReplyDeleteI totally hear you, Jen, on the showy aspect of it, but I think there are worse idols for kids to have.
Great debate!
Forgive me but what on earth is 'Tebowing'??? I have never heard of it.
ReplyDeleteI want to comment and join in but no idea what this is... LOL
have a lovely weekend anyhow. x
What a gerat debate. I do feel like a huge portion of Americans would FLIP out if a Muslim was displaying his religion on the football field.
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't care either way. Tebow doesn't affect my life...just like a Muslim, Buddhist, etc displaying their faith wouldn't affect my life. I think religion is personal and people get way to worked up over what other believe!
I was raised Catholics and Catholics tend to keep their religion to themselves. I like it this way. If we aren't at a religious function, then I don't want to hear about your religion. Just like I don't want to hear your politics =)
Nope, I wouldn't be offended. I believe that all religions should be valued and are important. As long as the people living out their faith are sincere and follow what they say they believe. The only thing that offends me is when people "use" their religion for show, attention and/or politics. Regardless of which religion it is.
ReplyDeleteIn the cases of Steeler Troy Polamalu who makes the sign of the cross after every play and Tim Tebow I do think it is genuine. Troy has said this, " Success in anything doesn't matter. As Mother Teresa said, God calls us not to be successful but to be faithful. My prayer is that I would glorify God no matter what, and not have success be the definition of it."
Actually, I feel bad for those who are offended.
That debate was great last week. I think it was one of your best "Feedback Friday" posts ever. And I'm not surprised that two people got into a fight over it. Any time it's religion or politics, people become defensive.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I disagree with a lot of the above-comments. "Tebowing" does get a lot of people riled up. But I guarantee (right or wrong) that if a player was "Tebowing" for another religion, that it would absolutely get more criticism and more media. Like Wendy said, Troy and Tim aren the norm. But if something was perceived as abnormal, it would create a firestorm and your friends would not speak for even longer. LOL.
I think that spirituality is absolutely essential to life. Each individual should show gratitude to the great spirit in his or her own way - no one has the right to tell another how or when to do so. It is not spirituality that has caused wars and arguments, it is religion and is "leaders" abuse of power. Thanks for letting me air my opinion!
ReplyDeleteDon't they do this anyway? Superstition is a *huge part of sports. Superstition isn't part of a christian faith. There are different talismans, different things grown men do before a game for their "luck". Some of them have to dance a certain way after a touchdown, etc... I don't see where that is any different from praying, or having a 'stance' that he stands in. The fact that we are more concerned about him having a "stance" of *prayer, versus all of the *rotten things that some of these players do is what baffles me. We are so busy discussing this guy who is behaving himself, living what he preaches, and just happens to believe in God and show it. It baffles me that *so many people are looking down on him for 'showboating' or whatever. What difference does it make? He's not raping women, dating young girls, involved in child porn, doing drugs, selling drugs, in a gang, etc... etc... etc...
ReplyDeleteI don't think anyone is saying that others cannot display their faith in a public arena. I believe those that are uncomfortable with witnessing those displays are simply saying that they would prefer that those acts be kept private and practiced in a more appropriate venue. I equate that to private conversations with my husband, or my best friend that may be better said in a more intimate way. I would be very uncomfortable with my husband or best friend telling the world all the reasons they love me at every opportunity. "To everything there is a season". If your goal or if you are comfortable about causing discomfort to others, maybe you need to examine your reasons for doing so.
ReplyDeleteI'm proud to be a Christain (child of God) but I'm not "church religious)
ReplyDeleteI'd be uncomfortable with any Muslin signage. Not because I'm against their religion cuz I think their God is the same as my God. It's just that there is so much negativity going on in the world that even the word "muslin" makes me sit up in an alert.
Prolly not fair, but there it is.